How I Almost Shut Down This Business – My Life Story, Part 3: May 2010 to June 2011

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My Life Story, Part 3

In June of 2011, I was very close to quitting this business, shutting down both sites, and deleting everything.

You’ve mostly read about success so far: overcoming obstacles, launching products, and yes, even surviving the occasional Korean girl who kept showing up at my apartment unannounced to steal my tomatoes.

Today, though, my story is about failure.

That is the part of entrepreneurial stories that never gets publicized, which is tragic – because it’s also the most representative of what it’s really like to run a business.

I made several huge mistakes from 2010 to 2011 that almost led to a complete shut-down, and today I’m going to cover all of them.

Here’s what’s coming up in Part 3 of my life story (see Part 1 and Part 2 first):

  • Why I decided to leave Asia and never come back (or so I thought at the time) after living there for close to 2 years.
  • Why creating the industry-specific modeling courses was ridiculously difficult, and how I made the biggest mistake with the easiest part of the process.
  • The real reason(s) why our partnership with Wall Street Oasis fell apart, and why you should never rely heavily on external partners.
  • How a visitor named “Raj Verma” misinterpreted one statement in a course outline and then blackmailed us, causing a gigantic mess known as “Raj-gate.”

Out of the entire series, this part most closely resembles The Social Network.

The Winklevoss Twins may even make an appearance if you’re paying close attention.

Did You Just Make the Dumbest Decision Ever?

Here’s where we left off if you’re joining this series midway through:

  • I launched the site in late 2007, gained a lot of traction in the first year, almost quit after the Wall Street collapse in September 2008, but then saved the site by the end of the year with the interview guide I launched.
  • I had met a female who claimed she was a professional drug dealer at a speed dating event in Beijing – and, obviously, I decided it was smart to follow her to Korea, where I had lived for almost a year by the middle of 2010.
  • I spent the 2009-2010 period trying really hard to kill myself by working like crazy on video production and ignoring everything else in life – it was sometimes fun, but mostly just highly productive.
  • And I had just re-launched all the modeling courses successfully… only to see everything fall apart in the aftermath as sales and traffic both fell off a cliff, partially because we split a single course into multiple courses.

Immediate Problems

The new course format was too confusing and there were too many sign-up options: what had been 1 big course was now split into 3 separate ones (Excel, basic modeling, advanced modeling) and 6 different sign-up options (3 * 2 * 1).

It’s not necessarily “wrong” to offer options, but you still have to guide people in a specific direction.

Too many options without a clear direction leads to indecision and lower sales – just ask Dan Ariely.

Too many readers were signing up for the Excel course because it was the cheapest, and because we didn’t make it clear that mastering Excel was NOT the same as mastering financial modeling.

So we changed that around, removed the standalone Excel course sign-up, and cut the sign-up options down from 6 to 3: the Excel and basic course together, the advanced course, or a bundle with both of those at a discounted rate.

That didn’t change things overnight, but it did make the sign-up options less confusing and it led to more sign-ups for the bundle package in the long-term.

To his credit, Patrick from WSO suggested some of these things when he saw the big drop-off after the launch finished in April 2010.

“Ah,” I thought, “this partnership is going so well! It’s great to have someone else also thinking through these issues and making good suggestions.”

So far so good, right?

Problems Solved?

Those changes, plus waiting a few months for recruiting to pick up, solved my major problem at the time: a complete drop-off in the business.

But then 2 other big problems emerged:

  • Living in Asia was getting depressing because most of my friends had left or were leaving by that point, I was in a mediocre and unfulfilling relationship, and everyday annoyances were driving me nuts.
  • I had also promised to create a PowerPoint course and industry-specific modeling courses on real estate, banks, and oil & gas within the next year, even though I knew exactly nothing about any of them when I made that promise.

A Food Tour Guide… or a Black Belt?

To get around the boredom, I tried a comical number of random activities:

  • Jiu-jitsu
  • Kick-boxing
  • Yoga (I’m normally too embarrassed to admit this one)
  • Ballroom dancing
  • Paintball / survival games
  • Homebrewing
  • And my favorite: I went on a few “food tours” to learn more about the culture, and ended up explaining Korea to foreigners who just landed and didn’t know anything. The guy running it was “impressed” with my knowledge and asked if I would become a tour guide. Nice thought, but I was still just a stupid white guy in Asia.

I felt like Ali G or Borat showing up to some of these events and asking nonsensical questions while everyone else was taking notes and looking very serious.

Industry-Specific Modeling – Mission: Impossible?

Creating the PowerPoint course was more difficult than expected because there were no good references or other courses on it, but you only use a fraction of PowerPoint’s features in finance – so it was still easier than the full modeling courses.

The industry-specific courses, by contrast, turned into an epic battle of Biblical portions.

I pored through books, other training programs, and random models sent in by readers – and I even contacted dozens of bankers in these industry groups to ask questions.

If you think bankers are unresponsive when you’re networking with them, try sending them 10-15 detailed questions on FIG accounting and see how responsive they are.

One time, I played phone tag with a friend-of-a-friend across multiple continents over the span of 2-3 weeks.

Finally we got in touch and I asked all my questions… only to realize that he didn’t even have good answers.

He had worked at a top bank and then gone onto a top PE firm, but he couldn’t explain (in detail) how to make revenue growth assumptions for a company in a certain industry.

I got similar results elsewhere: people didn’t know the answer, or I got 10 different answers from 10 different people.

What Next?

I thought about stripping down the entire project and creating shorter, 3-5 hour long “summary” modules for the 3 industries instead of extended, 20-30 hour long case studies.

I could just say that my plans had changed.

But then I realized that would be a HUGE mistake.

The problem? Competitors had full-fledged courses on these industries that were more than just short summaries.

Just to see how good they were, I paid $3,000+ of my own money to sign up and go through all of them…

And I couldn’t believe how much they were charging for courses that weren’t that great.

Releasing shorter, cheaper courses would have immediately put me at a disadvantage because I would have been saying, “Our material isn’t as in-depth as competitors’ and these are just short summaries… but look, it’s so cheap!”

You never want to be seen as the “budget option” in any market.

That strategy only works for Wal-Mart, and selling niche financial modeling courses isn’t quite the same as being a soul-less retailer bent on world domination.

So the plan was set: go all-out on these courses, create better material, and sell it for the same price as other courses in the market… right?

One Red Bull IV, Please

In Part 2, I told you how I stuck to a grueling pace in 2009 – 2010 where I was often working 12-14 hours per day, every day (“real work” – not 50% downtime like in investment banking).

I upped the intensity even further in August 2010 and taught myself accounting and valuation for commercial banks, created a case study of JP Morgan, and produced 15 hours of video all in the span of 4 weeks, with no prior knowledge of the sector.

I was drinking so much coffee that I began twitching uncontrollably on most days, but it had to get done because of my favorite technique: setting an impossible deadline (I was leaving for a trip to Europe on August 31st).

I released the course a few hours before hopping on the plane, and hoped nothing would go wrong as I was taking off.

It was the same process for the other industry-specific courses, but it was a bit less stressful since FIG proved to be the hardest sector to learn.

The content for these new courses turned out much better than expected.

They were better organized, they had more quick reference guides, and the formatting and explanations were much better than the first few courses I had created.

But then I screwed it all up by making one serious mistake

What’s Your Price?

For some unfathomable reason, I released each of these industry-specific courses for $97 USD initially.

This was a big problem because competitors’ courses sold for $400 to $1500+ and actually covered less material.

So not only was I sending a message that my own courses were worseprice send a big psychological signal, after all – but I was also earning less on each sale, even though anyone who signed up was willing to pay more (yes, really – we got emails to that effect).

I said the $97 price was the “early bird discount,” and I mentioned that the prices would all increase eventually (which they did).

But I waited 1.5 years before doing that, which was a very costly mistake.

The truth was that in the back of my mind, I didn’t think the courses were “good enough” – and I felt uncomfortable charging higher rates.

In Part 2 of this story, I said that sales and marketing are the most systematically under-taught skills in business schools.

Among business owners, though, pricing is the most systematically misunderstood aspect of business.

Pricing is about far more than how much revenue you generate – it affects everything from how you market yourself to how much you can spend on marketing and customer support to the types of employees you can attract.

There is sometimes a “sweet spot” where you can maximize revenue and/or profit…. but it is not always a good idea to pick that price if it compromises other aspects of your business, such as customer service.

This is why I would never sell a guide for $5.95: for that price, I would rather just give it away for free.

Business owners tend to underprice their own products and services, for the same reasons I did here: insecurity, the feeling that they’re not “good enough,” and a lack of market knowledge.

Doing so leads to lower sales, sub-par support (it’s much easier to support 10 customers rather than 1,000), and lower margins.

This is why we’ve shifted to selling higher-end courses and services and serving fewer customers over time.

Sure, there is also a market for $5.95 guides, but I do not want to be in that market.

Predictably Irrational Pricing

“So,” you’re thinking, “that’s interesting, but what evidence do you have that this was a mistake? Where are the numbers? Or is this just a theory you’ve dreamed up?”

When I raised the prices of the industry-specific modeling courses, unit sales increased.

Yes, you read that correctly: after raising the prices from $97 to $247, the volume of courses sold actually increased even though the price was 2.5x higher.

How could that possibly happen?

Let’s say that you’re looking to buy a new car, and you’re expecting to spend ~$10,000 USD on it. You find 1 model selling for $8,500, 1 model selling for $10,100, and one selling for $9,300.

Then you find 1 model selling for $2,500.

Would you think it’s a great bargain?

Or would you think there’s a defect with the car?

That’s what happened here: by pricing the courses so far below anything else out there, we were effectively saying, “We have an inferior product” even though that wasn’t the case.

Leaving Korea

Meanwhile, I had come to the conclusion that I had to leave Korea.

It had gotten to the point where even routine tasks like going to the convenience store filled me with rage.

After my first 9 months there, I started having less and less fun; I was in a fairly stable relationship, but I knew it wouldn’t last and I didn’t see it as a reason to stay.

My enthusiasm for learning the language had also plummeted. I made a lot of progress in the first 6 months, but after that I should have taken a class with a professor who could explain nuances and focus on “business formal” language.

Instead, I continued taking lessons from… a friend of my original bartender “teacher” I found on Craigslist.

I assumed that since I knew Japanese (similar grammar) and had studied Mandarin (shared vocabulary), I could tackle Korean on my own.

But I was wrong: Korean is significantly more difficult conversationally than either of those languages, and it is arguably THE most difficult language for native English speakers to learn.

By the middle-to-end of 2010, though, I just didn’t have enough enthusiasm to go take a real class or otherwise learn from a professional.

Farewell

I left the country in December 2010 and had a farewell party where everyone made an appearance: friends, my teacher, her friends, and yes, even various females I had dated (good thing they didn’t know each other).

I remember explaining to a friend how I would never return to the country.

He disagreed and said, “You think you’re leaving, but you’ll be back. This place finds a way to draw everyone back.”

I laughed at him, wished him the best of luck, and said I was heading off to Australia next.

I wasn’t quite ready to go back to the US, and I wanted a country that was “Western” but still “foreign” – so Australia seemed like a good fit.

Plus, I was a US citizen and I had an employment record and bank accounts to point to – how hard could it possibly be to get a visa?

Side Note: I’m laughing as I write these words in August 2013 because I’m currently sitting on a bench in the Seoul-Incheon International Airport. Yes, I’m back in Korea. My friend was right.

I’ll get to this story if I extend this series and write Part 5 in the future.

“My Enemies Are Everywhere And My Friends Are Fools.”

“It’s a common mistake among inexperienced founders to believe that a partnership with a big company will be their big break. Six months later they’re all saying the same thing: that was way more work than we expected, and we ended up getting practically nothing out of it.”

-Paul Graham, Do Things That Don’t Scale

Toward the end of 2010, I did an “end of year review” and uncovered some disturbing trends.

First, it was clear that the BIWS promotional partnership with Wall Street Oasis, which had expanded to a few other sites, was not a good deal for me.

Sales had increased, but profits were down because we were paying out a high commission on all product sales referred by others.

You might think, “Wait a minute – you’re selling digital products, who cares if you pay out a high commission? You have no expenses!”

And then you might think, “Don’t you want to be in as many places as you can be? Who cares if it cuts into your sales?”

Both of those thoughts are wrong.

Yes, I have higher margins than an offline retailer, but there are still big expenses – creating the courses, customer support, web development and design, paid advertising, promotional materials, bandwidth, etc. etc.

So if you think this is a 90% margin business, you’re off by an order of magnitude. Any business owner who claims to run a 90% margin business is lying or not doing the math correctly, e.g. not counting his/her own salary.

And yes, it’s good to “be everywhere” if you can… but not if it dramatically cuts into your margins.

A business like this could never be sold to another company or taken public, so I have to focus on the bottom-line.

Spending frivolously and waiting for an exit would be like Waiting for Godot.

It wasn’t just the numbers – by the end of the year, other problems with partners were popping up.

Some partners wanted their own custom pages, detailed reports, and special treatment; with others, the relationship was always uneasy because we were competing in some areas but were partnered in others.

It was like Apple and Samsung’s relationship, but 1 million times smaller.

I knew it wouldn’t last, and the only question was when to change the terms and what to say.

I was about to do this at the start of 2011 right after I settled down in Australia, but then…

Meet Raj Verma!

I ran into serious problems getting into Australia, partially because I was dumb and applied for a 12-month tourist visa – so in early 2011 I was stranded and wandering around Southeast Asia while trading letters with the Australian government.

But I was making better-than-expected time on the industry-specific courses, so I decided to use the 4 weeks I spent in Malaysia to revamp one part of the Advanced Modeling course and fix a few lessons that had been completed too hastily.

In the middle of that, someone named “Raj Verma” contacted us and asked a bunch of questions about the BIWS courses.

From his questions, I could tell that he would likely end up asking for a refund anyway – so I didn’t try too hard to convince him to sign up.

But he did notice one small inconsistency: in the course outline, I wrote there was a “50% discount on new courses.”

By “new” I meant “new courses that we release in the future.”

That was true at the time because each new course was priced at $97 back then, and members could sign up at a discounted rate of $47.

He interpreted “new” as meaning “any additional courses you sign up for.”

Yes, the language was confusing but it was a mistake on my part and not a “trick” or anything like that.

I clarified the language to him, acknowledged that it was confusing, and then did what I thought any logical human being would do: I corrected the course outline and sent him the new version.

The actual policy never changed – I simply corrected language that could have been misinterpreted.

Raj Verma didn’t quite see it that way – here was his response:

raj-verma-01

After a few more exchanges, he wrote back with one final demand – he left this one out of what he posted online:

raj-verma-02

He tried to blackmail us into giving him a $347 course for free because he misinterpreted one statement in the course outline, which we then clarified.

This guy was so clueless that he actually posted the entire email exchange online (yes, including the parts with him swearing at me), after which he got flamed out of existence.

Hundreds of posters jumped on him, his name and email address were black-listed at banks, and he probably changed his name shortly thereafter (if it even was his real name – doubtful).

And the best part was that he was NOT even a customer of the courses – he was just asking about potentially signing up.

The whole incident consumed 2 days of my time and caused me to reconsider if I really wanted to stay in this market for the long-term.

If potential customers were going to be this crazy, was it really worth it? Did I want staff members to spend their time responding to criminals?

It also forced me to delay changing the terms of the partnerships – after all, one of our key partners at the time (WSO) had just stepped in to defend us, or at least many users there had.

Arriving in Australia

My Australian visa finally came through, but by then I had already traveled back to the US to visit friends in New York and California. So after planning to arrive in Australia in early January, I only got there in late March of 2011.

Upon landing, the immigration officials pulled me aside for an “interrogation” because I seemed suspicious.

They were skeptical that I was really a “tourist” and started asking for all these stats about my business, the # of Australian customers, how we promote the courses in Australia, and so on.

“Well,” I thought, “I can get out of this one, but I’m sure glad I listed my occupation as ‘Consultant’ rather than ‘Drug Dealer’ on my immigration card this time around.”

A few days after that, I was diagnosed with a serious ear infection that could have resulted in permanent hearing loss.

Oh, and then the Internet took over a week to set up at my apartment.

And then I was in for one final surprise: I decided to live in the CBD of Sydney, thinking that a central location would be best.

But my building was 90% Asian, and so was the surrounding area.

It was as if I had tried to leave Korea, but Korea said to me, “Not so fast. You’re not getting away this easily.”

Life in Australia was off to an excellent start.

Location, Location, Location… and Launches

I was also way behind on the last industry-specific course: Real Estate & REIT Modeling.

I said the release date would be April 30th, 2011, but there was no way to finish by then given the disasters above, continued partnership troubles, and more and more crazy people emerging from the magical leprechaun forest.

So I pushed back the launch to May 15th, which was do-able, and pulled in Peter to help with some of the content.

Social life in Sydney was very “meh” because I didn’t have enough time to go out and meet people. It was a non-stop 80-90 hour per week effort once I landed, and almost losing my hearing cost me some time as well.

And then another sub-plot was evolving: some of our own partners approached me and suggested that our commissions were too generous.

“Brian, you realize that all these companies providing CFA prep, FRM training, and others are giving far lower commissions… and their products aren’t even as comprehensive. Why are you so generous?”

My “end of year review” showed similar results months ago, but I had been delayed changing things around and I didn’t want to do anything rash without running the numbers.

So I dug into the numbers, ran a bunch of analysis in Excel, and I even calculated R^2 for several sets of data.

Profits had actually decreased even as traffic increased, mostly due to these high commissions, plus the rising costs of support.

It went back to my main fear from the beginning: I knew there was huge audience overlap between the 2 major sites in this market (M&I and WSO), and I wasn’t convinced that we were getting unique visitors by partnering with him.

But there were big risks if I changed the terms.

First off, he could promote other companies’ courses instead of BIWS.

Second, I might have been using the wrong assumptions all along. There was no way to “prove” where new customers came from and who had seen the courses first via my own promotions vs. those on his site.

It could have been the case, for example, that a high percentage of customers had seen the BIWS courses promoted elsewhere, but had simply come back and signed up through this site anyway.

But there was no way to tell what would happen without actually making the changes.

That was the biggest decision I faced in 2011.

Do I change the terms of the agreement and possibly lose a huge percentage of sales?

Or do I leave it as is, keep everyone happy, and accept declining profits even as I kept working harder and harder?

I wanted to resolve this by June 1st to avoid letting it drag on for the rest of the year.

Gut Feeling and Fear-Setting

I went back and forth about 10 times, but ultimately I went with my gut feeling that it wasn’t a great deal for me and that the terms had to change, or the deal had to be dropped altogether.

I figured that even if the deal completely ended, the courses would continue to sell because of my audience on M&I and additional traffic to the site, plus word of mouth.

And, in the worst case scenario, if the entire business collapsed I would not have shed a tear.

Why?

Besides Raj Verma and a few other disasters, I was incredibly burned out.

Just imagine working for 80-90 hours per week for 2+ years, with only short breaks in between.

When I say “work,” I mean real work – writing, editing, producing videos, and creating sellable deliverables – not “work” in IB where you sit around the office with nothing to do for half the time, and doing mindless work such as changing the font sizes in revision #153 of a presentation the rest of the time.

I had produced nearly 3 million words of content in 2 years, which is about 30 average-length novels (not a typo).

Just like Patrick Bateman, I was barely human.

But just like Bateman, I also had my limits.

Going back into finance was not an option, but since I had a CS degree from a top university I had a “Plan B” that most people in finance do not have: go into the tech industry, either at a large company or a start-up, and work in a technical or product/project management role.

Sure, it can be intense… but it still would have been 10x easier than running this business, producing that volume of content, and also being the combined CEO, CFO, COO, and CTO.

Then there were other issues: for example, I was running out of ideas for M&I articles.

The obvious solutions were to cover new industries, do more interviews myself, or hire guest writers, but I didn’t know how sustainable those were.

Even if I found topics to keep writing about, did I really want to keep writing about this one specific topic forever?

Running a business like this in your 20s or 30s is one thing.

But could I really see myself as a 65-year old man who was still writing articles about how to get investment banking internships?

Let’s be honest: it would be pretty strange.

But there’s also no easy solution to that one – when you own a business, you’re at it for years or decades regardless of whether or not you “like it.”

Until you save enough money to do something else or you decide to sell the business (easier said than done), it is your life.

And it is also your wife/husband, your best friend, and your main hobby.

I almost hoped the entire business would fail simply so that I could go back to the real world, take a normal job again, and get back into a normal career.

The Choice

With that type of silly logic in mind, I decided to move ahead and reduce the commissions on our products.

I emailed Patrick to explain that the terms were changing, and he almost immediately dropped us.

I proposed a commission that was significantly lower than the original rate, and I expected him to counter with a higher offer.

My logic was flawed, though, because I had very little leverage in this situation.

He could simply promote another company’s courses and there would be no difference to him as long as the commissions stayed the same.

I don’t blame him at all for dropping us. We don’t “hate” each other. If I were in his position, I would have done the exact same thing.

From his perspective, this had come from nowhere after we had just worked together for the past 1.5 years.

He saw it as: “I just sent this guy $X in sales, where $X is a large number – why would you suddenly decide to reduce my rates after I sent you so many new customers?”

My perspective was different because I had all the numbers.

While he saw them as “new customers,” I had good reason to believe that many of them had actually seen the courses promoted on both sites and would have signed up through us anyway.

That made it a great deal for him, but a rather poor deal for us.

I replied and expected to go back and forth a few more times… but instead, it stopped and I didn’t hear anything for a few weeks.

Last-Minute Second Thoughts

I went to a friend’s wedding in Hawaii at the end of May 2011, partially to celebrate being done with the Real Estate course and partially because, well, it was Hawaii.

The whole time, I kept thinking about this deal and whether or not I had just made a huge mistake.

A few days before June 1st, I woke up and thought, “OK, this is stupid. This is going to destroy my business if I go forward with this. I have to propose better terms!”

NOTE: This type of thinking is a HUGE mistake. Once you propose something in a negotiation and the other person says “no,” never go back on your word and give better terms.

I didn’t follow my own advice though, so I checked in again and said I would be open to a higher rate, though not as high as the original one we had.

…And a few days later I heard back.

It was a “no go,” even with the higher rate.

He had already moved on a long time before that, and would be promoting other courses on his site as of June 1st.

It was over.

Reality Checks

The whole incident served as a reality check for me.

I had focused so much on the products that I ignored all other aspects of the business – diversifying our marketing, improving the user experience, staying in touch with customers after they had signed up, and more.

In response, I contacted a marketing firm and asked about hiring them to get started with paid advertising and to revamp marketing everywhere else.

I started planning my outreach to guest writers, knowing that if the site continued, I would need contributions from others.

And I planned a trip back to the US because I wanted to start networking and interviewing for traditional corporate jobs in the SF Bay Area.

I really had no idea what would happen, but it couldn’t hurt to have other options on the table.

No, I wasn’t going to run out of money anytime soon… but there was a significant chance that both sites would simply die out.

And hiring guest writers and a marketing team would only work if I had enough money to hire them in the first place.

That was in serious doubt as June 1st approached.

The Night Before June 1st

It was the night before the partnership would officially end, and there was nothing left for me to do.

Two years before, on June 1st, 2009, I had landed in Korea with almost nothing, a huge amount of debt, and a tiny business that barely paid the bills.

Two years later, on June 1st, 2011, I was about to lose everything I had built up in that time.

“I know,” I thought to myself, “I’ll make a pro/con list! Or I’ll start making a list of companies I want to work at!”

I decided to do something much smarter instead: I went snorkeling in the ocean near my hotel in Hawaii.

Oh, and then I read more Game of Thrones (I was on the 3rd book by then, easily the best in the series).

No matter what happened to my business, I reasoned, Tyrion would always be awesome.

I went to sleep early that night, and woke up the next day to see what would happen.

I turned on my laptop, and…

Next Time, Next Time

Yes, it’s a cliffhanger ending.

But you’ll see how I clawed my way out of this one in Part 4 of this series.

Plus:

  • Why hiring guest writers, or at least my implementation of it, turned out to be a questionable move.
  • How we funded, created, and produced Cost of Capital and why I wanted to do it in the first place.
  • Why I completely changed the direction of this business in 2012 after a harsh wake-up call from a top business coach.
  • And most fun of all: how a toxic relationship with the craziest person I’ve ever met almost destroyed me.

Stay tuned.

The Rest of the Series:

About the Author

is the Founder of Mergers & Inquisitions and Breaking Into Wall Street. In his spare time, he enjoys learning obscure Excel functions, editing resumes, obsessing over TV shows, and traveling so much that he's forced to add additional pages to his passport on a regular basis.

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66 Comments to “How I Almost Shut Down This Business – My Life Story, Part 3: May 2010 to June 2011”

Comments

  1. Steve says

    So I guess (just like a lot of college graduates) – you were also a little “confused” in terms of exactly what you want to do/pursue in your life back then?

  2. rt says

    as someone who starting using BIWS in 2010, went through all the courses – including the industry specific ones in 2011 – broke into an investment banking/private equity role in 2012, and recommended your site over the course of the last year and a half to incoming analysts, I can honestly say I’m pretty glad you didn’t quit. thanks for everything.

  3. Vp says

    Don’t know but this one was somewhat scary..
    I hope you are not changing terms & conditions of your products for existing customers..!? I mean i hope not to lose access or whatever, No doubt i owe your products for where i’m.
    Also, no plans of closing down this website/business, right?

    • says

      No on both of those. If anything did change, there would be an announcement long in advance, i.e. 6-12 months lead time.

      At this stage, there is about a 0.0001% chance of either site shutting down. They would only shut down if the finance industry itself shut down.

  4. ST says

    I’m sorry, but “new” does by no means mean “any additional”. I hope anybody who read this exchange had the common logic to understand that.

      • Josh says

        Hey Brian,

        My company has an office in Sydney and I’m hoping to move there in January. The office is on Sussex Street smack dab in the middle of the CBD.

        Any suggestions on where to live?

        • says

          Hmm… I lived on Park Street and it was actually a great location, very central to everything but the rent was sky-high. A 1BR apartment there is over $2500 USD, or at least it was when I lived there.

          If you don’t mind paying those rates, somewhere on that street is fine – otherwise to get a much lower rate you would have to have roommates or live further away.

  5. MK says

    My success in breaking into FIG at the first IB firm (top middle market) that invited me to the interview is greatly attributable to your courses, specifically, interview prep and FI modeling. You should feel a sense of pride for helping people to get their dreams come true, at least for me. Just wanted to sincerely thank you for all of your much appreciated hard work.

    I was one of those people who purchased your material for $97, which makes my ROI……well you get the point.

  6. Nemdam says

    Brian, given that you come from modest beginnings in NJ, what do your parents think of all of your ambitions? Between going to Stanford, being an I-banker, and starting a business overseas, were your parents always on board with all of this?

    • says

      I think they’re “neutral” on the matter. They don’t really understand anything I do, so I don’t think they’re wildly enthusiastic but they’re also not opposed to it as long as the business is doing well. The biggest issue is that they don’t understand why someone would want to work so much as opposed to just taking a normal, comfortable job.

  7. J says

    Enjoyed reading your story, esp. the part which you wrote about the incidents btw you and the “promotion guy” Patrick. Anyway when can we read part 5? (not 4!)

    • says

      Haha I can’t imagine why *you* would want to read Part 5, J… but it will be here soon! Just for you.

      (For anyone else reading this, we have someone who appeared in this story leaving a comment on it!)

  8. Jason says

    Hey Brian fo not ever close down your site man. I signed years ago but still havent got time to go through all the courses. Great story though! Cheers

  9. Joel D says

    Hi Brian,

    Wow! Quite a story and journey it’s been for you. I should have asked this after Part 1 itself: Did you maintain some kinda diary to document all this? Since it’s in such detail…Or do you have a photographic memory?

    Thanks for all the good work you’ve done.

    • says

      Thanks! Yes, I have a detailed journal going back to 2006 where I tracked everything. And then I created a summary journal for each month as well so I could quickly look up things.

      • Themb says

        Would you recommend doing this or some similar option of keeping track for everyone or is it just “your” thing?

  10. MJ says

    Awesome! Extremely educational and very entertaining. Thank you very much for sharing.

    Now please hurry up with part 4 and 5.. and keep going after that. ;)

  11. Ryan says

    Hi Brian, I purchased a number of your courses and I was wondering if they are just as relevant in Australia as they are in the US?

    • says

      Yes, I think they will be, or at least we’ve had a lot of Australian students and professionals use the courses over the years.

      There are some terminology differences e.g. sometimes you’ll see “Profit Before Tax” instead of “Pre-Tax Income” but overall the way you value companies and model deals is similar. IFRS and GAAP used to be more different, but they’ve been moving closer together over the years and are almost the same on major points now.

      A few years ago, several student competition teams in Australia actually used the Oil & Gas course models as templates for their own in the competition and did quite well.

  12. AC says

    Great read and inspiring. I am in the process of creating an online course in the health & nutrition field. What would be the best online course software to go with and what do you use for the IB courses?

    • says

      Thanks! It depends on what you are creating. We use a heavily customized version of WordPress for the site itself and I use Camtasia Studio for all the videos (Screenflow on the Mac is good). Articulate software products are also good for interactive diagrams and other training materials.

  13. says

    Great read !your story shows behind the screen pain, dilemma , challenges an successful entrepreneur faces which we tend to ignore. Can’t wait for the next part.

  14. Zing says

    Hey Brian, great post! Can’t wait for the next part. I saw that you used infusionsoft for BIWS. How do you like the software so far?

    • says

      Thanks! InfusionSoft is very powerful, but you have to put in a lot of time to use it to its full potential. Most people do not do that, or are confused about how it works in the first place. Besides some odd quirks, it has worked quite well for us.

    • says

      Yeah I actually do use it quite often when assigning work to developers or helping them to troubleshoot problems. And sometimes I even jump in and edit code if it’s something simple and I don’t want to wait for someone else to do it. Nothing as intense as writing an OS or compiler, but I can still edit web app code quite well.

  15. Jay says

    Brian,
    You have been indeed a very generous person (personal experience). I am so glad that you didn’t shut down the site. I am also looking fwd to read your part 4 and 5.

    regards,
    Jay.

    PS: Have you been maintaining electronic journal. I have been trying to keep one for myself, but hasn’t worked out yet. Any suggestions?

    • says

      Thanks!

      Journal: the key is to keep it very simple and take no more than a few minutes per day doing it. I actually record everything via loggingit.com to get the information down and then write it up later.

  16. Lupin says

    Hi Brian,

    I discovered M&I few months ago and I eagerly read everything on it ! I particularly like the “bullshit free” approach and the straight-to-the-point style :) I learned so much in this site so thank you !

    It’s also very interesting to read about the history of M&I and how it all started. Myself having a few ideas of similar ventures, it’s been inspiring.

    I was really surprised to learn that you spent some time of your life in Korea (heck, you’re in Seoul now!), as myself I came here in 2009 to do my undergrad (Business Major at the old Yonsei rival uni, you should know :D).

    How come you never really covered Korea’s IB recruiting, like you did for other exotic financial places (Dubai, KSA, Singapore) ? I would love to know your insights about it. Maybe an interview with someone already in?

    As a 3rd year student here, armed with the advice I gathered on M&I, I started to look for an internship here with foreign bulge bracket banks and here are some of the conclusions I would like to share :

    1. The competition in Korea is generally tougher than anywhere else in the world. A GPA of 3.5 is considered as low here and Koreans are incredibly obsessed with credentials. There is competition for everything, and for top internships at top firms (IB or consulting), you almost always end up facing a huge pool of “perfect” candidates on paper: perfect GPA, lots of student activities and clubs, maybe one or two case competitions, etc. Sleep is optional in Korea.

    2. Somewhere on the site, I read that unless you have full proficiency of a language that actually allows you to understand complex newspaper level articles on topics like economics and politics, you can leave it out. This fully takes on meaning in Korea; unlike Hong Kong or Singapore, it’s generally nearly impossible to work in Korea unless you master Korean language, and this is true even for foreign banks. Does it mean all hope is lost for us poor foreigners?

    3. Not quite. During my research, I came across one or two banks operating in Asia from Seoul but not requiring a native level proficiency. Which leads me to think it is possible to break into equity/M&A in Korea as a foreigner, but the odds are just considerably lower than any other place. Hiring foreigners here is not the norm- After all, I belong to one of the first batches of international students coming to pursue full time degrees in Korean universities and the Korean society has still a long way to go to be truly globalized.

    These are my observations as a student. I would really love to hear from a professional here!

    Anyway, enjoy your time in Korea :) As you will realize very soon, now we are 100% LTE, nobody gives a damn about PSY’s Gentleman anymore and there is a new cute female president in the house haha!

    • C says

      I think I can take a stab at this.
      1. Guessing he didn’t cover it because Korean IB is mostly focused on client management while all real execution is out of HK. Also, the credentials you mentioned are for the non-relationship hires. A large part of hires are relationship hires (ie korean-born ivy league grad chaebol/???? 2nd generations), and your pedigree is all the credentials needed.
      2. Koreans like hiring internationals to be poster children for diversity and to be figureheads for dealing with multi-national corporations, but these guys are NOT Entry level. At the lower level, think it’s a hail-mary pass. Let’s be honest: you have no competitive advantage in this game. You’re less connected, culture isn’t as instilled in you, and your language skills aren’t up to scratch. There’s no reason to take you over a SKY native-born Korean, at least at the entry level. Your best shot would be impressing foreign senior management who will pull for you. You’re not going to stand out in a crowd.
      3. Agree with the odds. Sorry for being bleak, but I truly think this is a stacked deck against you.

      PS, Brian, thank you for this site. Been a tremendous help. I have a return offer from a top bank and am currently shopping around!

    • says

      What C said, but I would also add:

      Sure, I would like to cover IB in Korea but so far no one has volunteered to contribute an interview on that one.

      I am limited by who wants to contribute to the site in the first place – “hunting down” interviewees generally yields poor interviews, so I prefer not to do that.

      It is a smaller market than other Asian countries, so it’s not surprising that no one has volunteered to do an interview on this one yet.

  17. Boudi says

    I would like to ask you, im 35 years old and im interested to engage in M&A sector. Do you think that im able to get opportunity to take an M&A job at that age if i get these courses? i have no history job experience in good companies .(im self-employed) but i hold MBA. Thankd

    • says

      It really depends on what your work experience looks like and what roles you’re going for.

      If you have worked for 10+ years, you would not stand a good chance at entry-level jobs in IB because they are looking for undergrads/MBAs or those with only 1-2 years of experience.

      You would probably have better luck going for operational roles in PE or VC if you’ve held executive/leadership roles in a specific industry before.

      The courses might help depending on your circumstances, but you’ll have to answer those questions above first.

  18. Return visitor says

    Hey Brian- just came by to say hi again. 3 years ago when I was a junior and then senior, I was literally obsessed with your site because I wanted to do ibanking so bad. I didn’t manage to get in, but worked in the finance-related field in NYC for a while before leaving the States. Sad to leave NYC but couldn’t be any happier that I didn’t get the opportunity to spend a single day in banking, lol. Needless to say, I stopped reading your site since. 3 years later and still struggling, but it feels so much better this time as I have found what I love. Just thought about my silly finance obsession and wanted to see what your site is up to and found this amazing series about your success and mishaps running your online business. It is so engrossing and resonating that I feel oblidged to leave a comment, so here am I. Thank you and don’t stop the series and the site. People obviously need you, haha.

  19. Steven says

    Hi Brian,

    I love this series! Please keep them coming. I am a sophomore undergrad student and was wondering if you think it is still too early for me to start prepping with the BIWS courses?

    • says

      Thanks! I wouldn’t say it’s “too early” but you probably don’t want to go all-out studying at this stage because you might forget a lot by the time internship recruiting comes around next year. So you can get started, but I would save most of your studying for 5-6 months before recruiting begins and take it from there.

  20. A friend says

    Brian,

    Just sell your business to bigger players like WSP or FACTSET. It sounds like you hit the bottleneck on this business. Instead disappoitment thousdans of royal visitors like me, I hope you can keep this site running.

    Good luck

    • says

      This happened 2 years ago (2011) and we’ve grown by a huge amount since then. So I have no plans to do anything different. I would never sell, nor would a sale even be possible in this market.

  21. CC says

    Brian,

    I really enjoyed reading this candid post. Like you said, you never hear about the failures in entrepreneurship and start-up stories. The lessons you learned and shared are pretty insightful.

    I had always wondered about why WSO switched to Wall Street Prep (Patrick probably getting a better rate offer being a reason aside), especially given BIWS’s popularity and glowing reviews… But even if WSO “officially” backs WSP these days, BIWS is still heavily favored and promoted by WSO users in all the training program-related threads. So goes to show the value of word of mouth.

    Despite all your hardships, I’m really glad you’ve kept M&I and BIWS going and I’m sure I speak for many others when I say it’s really the best program out there bar none. The quality and level of care you take really shows, whereas other programs just mail it in. I’ve had access to other programs (TTS, WSP, etc.) via IB training, or school back in the day, and BIWS is really the only thing I still use as a reference because other offerings deal with very basic situations or feel quite dated. In addition to having more bells and whistles, the thing that BIWS does extremely well is not only showing its users the “how” behind modeling, valuations, etc., but getting them to understand “why” something is done.

    I’m looking forward to to reading Part 4, and also catching up on some of the recent interview posts on Infrastructure investing. Good luck on expanding the site and realizing returns on all your efforts.

    • says

      Thanks! Glad to hear it. Yes, word of mouth is definitely essential, and a lot of other programs don’t really care much about online learning experience since they’re so focused on classroom training.

      Glad to hear everything has been helpful for you and good luck!

  22. says

    I am a costumer of BIWS. I have to say that I gave up on breaking into IB (All my fault, since I think your product is awesome and I really admire the passion and effort you put).

    Nevertheless I still read all your interesting articles. I enjoy your honesty and advise. Thanks Brian! Keep them coming,…You are the next Michael Lewis

    • says

      Thanks! Don’t give up though… maybe you don’t get into IB right now, but you could always go for related areas like Big 4 valuation / TAS, corporate finance, and so on. It’s actually becoming easier currently to move into IB from one of those vs. the environment in past years.

  23. Mey says

    Hi Brian,

    I had just finished reading the part 3 of “How I Started This Site” (another way of living vicariously when I’m not doing it through Korean dramas) when the new layout of your website came along. I just wanted to say congratulations for your great job (was actually about to ‘complain’ about the fact that I had no direct access to the most recent articles on your homepage anymore before I scrolled down the page and found out that it was still here).

    Anyway, thank you for the articles and advice you give here, it helps me a lot in my internal struggle on ‘is IB really for me?’. I usually never write comments on websites partly because I fear that I end up writing nonsense … which is why I’m ending my comment now.

    So good luck for everything, it’s so good to see that your hard work paid.

    Greetings from France!

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