100 Meter Dash Q&A: Shaving, New Layout, Book Recommendations, College Majors, Breaking Into Banking, Best Cities For VC
What would you do if I told you your facial hair affected your chances of getting into finance? Some of you might nod, knowingly, while others might be reluctant to believe me.
For those who are reluctant: go shave, right now.
And then read the rest of this week’s Q&A below.
1. Must investment bankers be clean-shaven? Not that this is a deal-breaker for me, but I have a beard I really like….
Yes, they must. I’ve never seen anyone with a beard in this industry. They take appearances pretty seriously, and even something as minor as hair dye is usually not tolerated. My friend had to remove his before starting a banking internship a few years ago.
2. I got a full-time offer at a bulge bracket bank, but I want to shop it around. My former co-workers at the bank would make excellent references and are completely separate from the hiring team- would it be safe to use them when I shop my offer around? Or should I use my older references?
I strongly suggest not doing this. The market is too tough right now to risk losing your full-time offer over rumors leaking from your group to HR, and this could easily happen at a bank. Go with your old references.
3. I’m interested in investment banking, but I’ve worked for over 5 years in the entertainment industry as a director for small films. If I went to a top 10 MBA program could I still get in? Or would they question my background?
You could certainly use a top 10 MBA to re-position yourself but I’d recommend getting some business-related experience before going for your degree. It doesn’t necessarily have to be banking or finance, just anything that shows you can work in an office environment.
4. Why did you choose to do banking rather than consulting? How is the work different?
I’m sure you guys have all seen the video by now - just refer to that if you have any questions.
Real answer: There were a number of reasons, including my hatred for travel every week. I’ll cover this in more depth in the coming weeks since it’s a popular topic among college seniors in what-should-I-do-with-my-life mode.
5. I’ve been working for a few years in a finance-related role in the government. Does this count as “finance experience,” even though it’s for the government?
It’s more relevant than being a pop star or a traveling bard, but it’s less helpful than having actual finance experience at a company.
6. I really like the new layout and I feel kind of sadistic saying this, but I kind of miss the noose in your old logo…
I miss the noose too, but all good things must end. The noose was just one of the casualties of my new design. Though I was thinking about using it as a transparent background image across all my content for awhile…
7. I have 5 years of commercial banking experience - can I get into investment banking without an MBA?
Tough to do, because you’d be in between an Analyst and an Associate and banks wouldn’t know what to do with you. I would recommend business school; if you don’t want to go that route I would suggest networking your way into a smaller, local firm.
8. I graduated from a non-target school with a science major. Would an online business degree help me break in?
No. Going back for a Master’s degree in business/finance at a real university might give you a marginal boost, but getting relevant work experience, even somewhere small, would make the biggest difference.
9. Do you have any book recommendations for learning about the industry?
What, you mean besides Damn, It Feels Good To Be A Banker? If you want “non-fiction,” then check out The Accidental Investment Banker and Monkey Business. I see suggestions on other books occasionally but I haven’t read most of them so I can’t recommend much else (yet).
10. Which city is better for getting into venture capital, San Francisco or New York?
All the major VC firms are in Silicon Valley, so San Francisco is clearly better. Yes, yes, I know there are VCs in New York as well but there are far more on the West Coast.
11. What should I pick as my major in college? Do I need to do Accounting or Finance?
No, you should major in something that interests you. While Accounting/Finance classes definitely help you, getting the relevant experience helps a lot more.
12. Do you know anything about the other divisions of a bank besides investment banking?
Didn’t I tell you to forget about the back office?
I do know a bit about other front-office divisions like equity research and asset management but I’m certainly not an expert - I would have to bring in a guest writer if you want to read more about those (let me know if you’re interested).
13. I am just finishing up my undergraduate degree in finance at age 30. Can I still get into banking as an Analyst?
That’s tough - if I were you I would go for an MBA. They know 30-year olds are less likely to tolerate 90-100 hour weeks than 22-year olds are. I do know Associates who have broken in at close to 40 so that seems a lot more viable.
14. I have an upcoming “fit” interview at a bank in a few weeks. What do they look for?
The most important part is creating a solid “story” about your background and why you want to do banking. It has to be brief - 3 minutes or less - and sincere. You also need to show that you can work hard, know what you’re getting into, have a strong interest in business and can act as a leader. You also want to prove you have some quantitative ability if you’re an English major.
(This is the 30 second answer to a question I could write a book about.)
15. I like the new layout but there’s one problem: when I’m goofing off at work now I can’t read your site because it stands out too much!
Ok, you win - this is the one part of the new design I hadn’t considered. Maybe you can disable images in your browser so it’s not as striking? Or learn to use Alt Tab more effectively?
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Tags: Accounting, Back Office, business school, investment banking, Master's Degree, MBA, networking, understanding investment banking, Venture Capital
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No beards, check. What about mustaches or goatees, or is no facial hair at all typically required?
It might work (see: Frank Quattrone) but overall I’d recommend minimizing your facial hair.
I have a goatee and never had a problem, just make sure it’s trimmed neatly and you’re otherwise clean shaven. It’s all about performance, so just make sure you do a good job.
I am currently 20 years old, and I want to get into investment banking. I was wondering what is the best way to get in….
My first option is doing an undergraduate business course at a top business school.
My second option is to do CFA course.
My third option is to do an MsC.
I was wondering which option will best prepare me to be successful as an analyst and will also enable me to start working as soon as possible.
Thank You
Option 1 is best. CFA is useless, MsC is also relatively useless.
I was in banking and had a goatee and I got a top bonus….just make sure its clean…make sure you know your shit, you wear Brooks Brothers and live the “culture of wealth”
@Ashwin read the rest of the site….
Brooks Brothers is a bit too… pedestrian. You should buy everything Bespoke… unless you’re spending $10K per suit, you don’t belong in finance.
(Kidding, to anyone else reading this… if you spend $10K on a suit you will soon have no money left.)
Consultants… Aside from the video, what type of life is expected? I assume you have more of a life than an investment banker, but how much money do you make (this is just a curiosity question). If I worked at FactSet as a Consultant in the investment banking area, what type of stuff would I do and would that prepare me for a jump into Investment Banking?
Well there’s a big difference between management consultants and all other types of consultants… management consultants work a bit less in general (maybe 60-70 hour weeks vs. 90-100) but that’s tough to generalize because they also travel a lot more. They make a lot less money as well, base salary is about the same but bonuses are significantly lower.
As far as a FactSet Consultant - I would try to move to a boutique or smaller bank, there’s nothing else you can do in your current role that will help a whole lot at this point.
What exactly would you say is finance experience ? What positions and what type of companies? If there is a previous article you wrote outlining what is finance experience please post it.
Thanks
Finance experience: banking, private equity, hedge funds, business development, CFO/Treasury positions at a company, asset/wealth management, maybe a few others. Basically anything that involves business/finance and working with clients rather than supporting others.
Hi,
I was wondering about the hair dye reference. As typical of Asian girls, I have my hair highlighted brown-blond. I’m looking more at internships / full time opportunities in Asia-Pacific, would this be acceptable?
I’m actually not sure of that one, but I don’t think any of the girls I worked with had highlights. In Asia-Pac it might be more acceptable though.
On the topic of facial hair, would a cleanly cut, precise light “french beard” not be acceptable or looked down upon at interviews?
Personally I would not do that, you want to be as conservative as possible.
I’ve been reading your website for couple of months now, great stuff. Question about question #11: “What should I pick as my major in college? Do I need to do or Finance? ”
I am double majoring in Applied Mathematics/Economics (I try to take business-related classes), plan on doing IB for 2-3 years, then MBA in Finance. One of my econ professors (also works for Feds in San-Francisco) strongly advised me to take as many Statistics classes as I can, and preferably get a minor. Knowledge of three software packages Excel, MATLAB (math programming), and Minitab (computing package) would also be a great plus. And of course internship. What is your opinion about these two advices?
Beyond the basics like mean/median etc., Stats is almost useless in banking. There’s literally no advanced math, and while Excel is definitely essential, we never use MATLAB or Minitab for anything. Your professor is probably thinking more of quant-like positions.
Is it true that when your 30, you will look like 50?
Yes.
Do people get fired often?
What are your chances of becoming an MD realistically. Supposing you do the job well and put in quite a lot of effort?
And do you need to be really good at math to be good at I-banking. I have never used excel before, and so when i finished my A-levels… how do I learn to use excel efficiently and what kind of business course should i enrol myself in? E.G. BBA
Have you been reading any headlines lately?
Yes, people get fired very often and the industry is very unstable.
From Analyst to MD… I’d say chances are maybe 1/100, you burn out along the way and lots of people realize it’s not what they were looking for in the first place. Plus it takes 10 years of never having a life.
No, you don’t need to be good at math, the math in i-banking is about as complex as 2 + 2 = 4.
damn, it does NOT feel good to be a banker right now. great inquisitor…what is opinion of the traditional IBD now that two of the biggest employers have just been wiped out. is there even the slightest chance of getting a summer analyst position now? when will the glory days of M&A return?
in addition, do you feel that boutiques like rothschild, lazard, moelis, perella, evercore will grow and fill lehman, bear, and merrill’s empty spots? is america doomed to lose its dominant position in the world of finance?
Yeah, US is pretty much screwed. And no, boutiques will never grow to be that big, market is too bad.
See my latest. Summer analysts are actually in a better position than FT people. Glory days will not return for a long time, if ever.
So why would anyone want to go into investment banking in the first place? Besides the money……
And once your fired, where do you go from then?
If you get fired btw… can u get into another investment banking firm? Or will u haveno chance because u got fired
Well it’s a lot more interesting than most jobs out there… each day is different. And some people like getting to work with big companies and advise on important matters.
If you’re fired, you could go to another firm or switch industries… but it’s harder to switch the higher up you move.
I am a college senior…due to the job market this year I have accepted an offer to work in Audit for a Big4 firm. Now I am reading on your site about how to stay away from the “back office” and am having second thoughts. I’m probably going to work in Big4 for 2 yrs….for somebody who wants to get into a finance-related field long-term, what would you recommend? Obviously it’s difficult to reposition oneself after too long in the industry.
Audit at Big 4 is still better than back office at a bank. I would try to move to the TAS group at the Big 4, though, rather than staying in Audit.